Leaked NIS ID Cards Document
Guido has uploaded the entire document annotated by NO2ID.
Some points of interest:
1) [Page 4, bullet point 3] Despite current assertions they are sticking with fingerprints, the strategy clearly includes options to gather personal information and issue ID cards WITHOUT fingerprints, e.g. "rising 16 year olds could be sent pre-populated forms for the Inclusion card... which would only need to be signed and returned".
2) [Page 4, bullet point 5] Indication that up to 10% of the population will be called in for 'interrogation' (ID interviews).
3) [Page 3, bullet point 1] Language suggests it will effectively be compulsory to *carry* the card - counter to Ministerial assertion.
4) [Page 5,'Next Steps', bullet point 1] Initial target groups ("trusted relationships") to be identified and confirmed by end of January 2008 - i.e. within the next 48 hours!
5) [Page 4, bullet point 6] They are explicitly pursuing a policy of "coercion" not compulsion because universal compulsion "cannot be delivered quickly due to the need for inevitably controversial and time consuming primary legislation and would pose serious political, enforcement and resource challenges."
79 comments:
they really are scum arnt they. devious lying bastards.
vote them out!
Looking at the doc they're also planning to sell our addresses.
delivery of identity services to the private sector
Terrible. So not only do we pay through the nose for this security risk of a database and card, but we get spammed as a thank you for it.
This confirms the worst fears of so many of us. One comment in the document (highlighted by No2ID) is "make life easier". The objective then is to make life easier for the state, to hell with the individual.
I suppose my greatest objection to this scheme is that although the present govt may have totally benign objectives in setting up the scheme they cannot guarantee that later govt’s will be similarly benign.
Who knows, a future govt may find the ID card system and database “makes life easier” when they want to round up the Jews.
Are NuLab really this stupid? Sadly the answer is yes.
Whoever annotated the document is clearly paranoid. Their interpretation of a lot of the points is peculiar. They don't live in the real world.
Loss of your freedom doesn't happen overnight and conning the people also plays a big part. If I tell you I am going to kick you ten times but only kick you three then you might think that you are getting off lightly and the same appears to be happening with ID cards.
They will probably tell us that this is to curb immigration and fraudulent claims etc, always guaranteed to get support.
They must be stopped NOW!
What did people expect when they voted Labour? Stalin lives again!
conway gone.
Conway has Whip withdrawn - BBC. Another Guido victory...?
It appears Conway has lost the whip, so the poll is a bit academic.
Thank fuck us jocks won't have them - well not while the SNP are in power...
Jesus are you living in East Germany circa 1985?
And why is there no revolt? Why do you English just sit and take what is dished out to you? Are you weak or what?
From a department that even the politicians that are meant to run it describe as "not fit for purpose".
Thanks for the heads up Guido.
Keep dishing it out to all and sundry
Well done Guido. Good to see you're on top form, exposing these bastards and their attempt to bring in a police state.
As if the others would be any better.
If the people are sheep they deserve to be fleeced
Fucking bastards aren't getting any of my details on a database, let alone my fingerprints - they can't jail the lot of us !!!
Sounds very sinister
Don't you just love integrity in a politician....of any colour, cast or creed.
It is difficult to think up a suitably fitting punishment. They would all be over too quickly.
Forgot the name of that professor who appeared on Newsnight a few months ago? 'Alexander'? He said NHS records COULD NOT be made secure with access from potentially 100000s of users.Child protection records COULD NOT be made secure.I don't want to live in a police state!!! Someone MUST stand up against this or we'll not only have corrupt government but all-powerfull government too.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml;jsessionid=XIGDVROIIZ35RQFIQMFCFGGAVCBQYIV0?xml=/news/2008/01/29/nconway429.xml
Conway's lost the whip.
page 4 bullet point 6,
read - ID cards = political suicide.
Nigel Waterson, Tory MP for Eastbourne and shadow minister for Work and Pensions, was arrested yesterday for allegedly assaulting his teenage son and daughter. Well he only deals with OAPs so does what does this have to do with anything. If he was beating up OAPs that would be wrong.
anon 12:36,
I think the general consensus is that voting them out will be insufficient. Stakes and garlic and silver crosses will be required , just to make sure they never come back to haunt us.
Neither the Inland Revenue nor your local council seem to need you to prove your ID for them to fuck you over with their taxes.
I will not submit myself to the Nazi inspired system, and NEVER have a card.
I was born a free man (thanks to my grandparents and others immense sacrifice in World War Two), and I will die a free man. New Labour can go fuck themselves.
Agreed - now large numbers of people are going to be interrogated! Who by and for what purpose?
Its a pity they don't have mind readers, would allow the scum to take all wrong thinking people off the streets straight away.
Let's face it. These cunts think they own us.
We are mere cattle, whose only purpose is to facilitate the lifestyle of the political classes, and their friends.
ID cards fundamental alter the relationship between the citizen and the state. Instead of being servants of the citizenry, they become the masters.
If they go ahead with this, and anyone in the military wants to start a very British coup, then I'll join you on the barricades.
Utter, utter cunts!
Dave appears to be dithering on Waterson as well - hasn't he needed time off from his DWP shadow role in order to clear his name since Sunday?
What a bunch of cunts.
You let Shami at Liberty in on this?.
Isn't life in wonderful under our glorious leader! Absolutely not a whisper of stealthy moves concocted by a collection of despicable civil-servants who are more interested in a Knighthood than loss of civil rights.
O/T for this thread. From....
http://www.politics.co.uk/
Better late than never!
Cameron withdraws Conway whip.
Conservative leader David Cameron has removed the whip from backbencher Derek Conway as controversy over alleged overpayments continued today.
Mr Conway faces a ten-day suspension from the Commons chamber after the standards and privileges committee found he had paid his son an unreasonably high salary for little apparent work.
Mr Conway was forced to apologise "unreservedly" to the house for what he described as his "administrative shortcomings". The committee had found his son Freddie, who was studying at Newcastle University during the time he was supposed to be working for his father, had had "little or not contact" with Mr Conway's office.
A statement from Mr Cameron said: "The usual procedure in these cases is to leave the punishment to the House of Commons authorities.
"However, having asked the chief whip to speak again to Mr Conway and having personally reflected overnight I have decided to withdraw the Conservative whip from Mr Conway."
The BBC reported the MP for Old Bexley and Sidcup describing Mr Cameron's decision as "understandable". It means he is no longer a member of the Conservative parliamentary party.
The latest development does not put the issue at rest, however.
cont
Excellent, Guido.
Confirms what we've been saying for years - but now it's all in writing. Surely no-one can doubt their evil motives now?
Control-freakery-just say "NO"
They have gone past the label "scum".
They have surpassed anything that the communists could and have done to their people. Yet have not realised that such controlfreakery brings no good to the people not themselves.
They have made liberty a crime and used every trick in the book to control us.
What we should be doing is holding them accountable, find every fault and report it, once reported ensure that it is acted upon. Let THEM know that crime does not pay and seize all their ill-gotten gains. Take their pensions and make them do time.
They were put there on a mandate and surely they are in breach of it even just on the EU mandate and this should be acted on.
Is there no legal eagle here who can find out what to do if the gov are in breach of contract?
Time for action, not just change.
Control-freakery-just say "NO"
They have gone past the label "scum".
They have surpassed anything that the communists could and have done to their people. Yet have not realised that such controlfreakery brings no good to the people not themselves.
They have made liberty a crime and used every trick in the book to control us.
What we should be doing is holding them accountable, find every fault and report it, once reported ensure that it is acted upon. Let THEM know that crime does not pay and seize all their ill-gotten gains. Take their pensions and make them do time.
They were put there on a mandate and surely they are in breach of it even just on the EU mandate and this should be acted on.
Is there no legal eagle here who can find out what to do if the gov are in breach of contract?
Time for action, not just change.
In a country where a landlord can get fined £10,000 for allowing his customers to smoke while at the same time politicians get a slap on the wrist for fraud involving thousands of £££'s, I expect no more from this cesspit of a Government.
Our only consolation in all this is, with this governments track record, it will never work. This, of course, will only be conceded after they have succeeded in wasting countless £billions of our money. What a very sinister bunch they are.
If ever we needed a parliament, stocked with people capable of independant, joined up thinking, it's now.
What do we get instead, a load of sycophantic hypocrites. Some of whom have the iq of a newt, one of them did'nt know what the word " fetish " meant! Would the speaker get a job in Mcdonalds?
So the chances of them reading, and understanding, this document, must be close to zero.
Rope and lampposts, seems to be the only answer, but you better buy them now, 'cause once you've got a card, they'll know! :)
Bring it on.
I can only assume that this is the plan: instigate a policy that is unpopular-get casatigated in the press-lose the support of the public-lose the support of the opposition-lose the parliamentry vote-get voted out of office-the next lot will spin it out-win the parliamentry vote as everyone knows this is a sound idea-we all have to have an ID card.
can`t wait.
Well, all we have to do is for all of us to say
NO 2 ID
and not turn up to be interrogated. Then what will the cunts do? Arrest us one by one? But there are no prison spaces. Send in the bailiffs? And have whole neighbourhoods turn on the bailiffs.
Fuck them. FUCK THEM.
Just say NO.
I am not a number. Politicians serve US and not them.
FUCK THEM
If you get a form just end it back as unknown at this address.
What does dithery Dave have to say about all this?
What a bunch of devious bastards, control freakery at its best, we want to know all about you but you musn't know what we're up to, trust us we only have your best interests at heart - bollocks as usual.
Bloody unbelievable - what a combination of contempt for the governed and incompetence! "Nationalisation certificate" instead of "naturalisation certificate"...
you really can picture it , an organised trudge of boots and grey work clothes , heads down arriving outside the office or factory gate ,gordon broon looking on from his penthouse office suite , signalling which men and women need corrective treatment, your id car registering every place you go every purchase you make.
the stasi living best apartments on canary wharf .
welcome to gordon browns vision of britain
Bit early to comment fully but it appears in line with the grand strategy to turn the population into mindless, illiterate, docile, subservient wagedonkeys.
Keep them in the dark and feed them bullshit.(the cult of celebrity)
Stop them assembling in groups of 3or more (ASBO)
Instill a culture of fear, Create a bogeyman, Get the population to beg the government to protect them
Make drugs cheap and readily available and socially acceptable
Destroy the education service so that the masses become effectively illiterate
Destroy the electorate's faith in parliamentary politics. Encourage the attitude that says "don't vote for them, it only makes them worse"
Close down all the industry, loot the country, give away our sovereign rights.
Just speculation of course.
It couldn't possible happen here
could it?
could it?
errr......
The worrying thing is that these ID cards will be taken as gospel for things like, pensions, banks, benefits, tax, and passport applications etc. Can you imagine the scenario, where they loose a load of ID card files (again) and the identity thieves get hold of them?
It is also worrying when the DWP is issuing duplicate NI numbers! Imagine the chaos if they get this expensive IT project through?
Surely the money is better spent on people and police on the ground. Oh and some more prison places to lock the bad guys up in?
Perhaps that is too much like common sense?!
Matt
Can someone please make T-shirts saying, "1984 was a warning, not a guidebook!"
And then strangle the pro-ID camp with them.
Coercion not compulsion eh? I expect that means you won't be able to do anything without having your bloody card with you. I can see it now.
"Post a letter special delivery sir? Certainly... can I see your ID card?"
"Cash a cheque sir?... ID card?"
"Half an ounce of Amber Leaf and 4 bottles of Pedigree Six... ID card?"
"Day return to Bath sir... can I see your ID card?"
Throw these power mad bastards out now!
It is high time some co-conspirators found out the names and addresses of the Senior and middle-ranking Civil Servants in charge of this scheme and published them on the web.
The others could start arranging fatal accidents on the underground to and from work for these people.
Every person involved in this scheme is a TRAITOR to the people of England and deserves death - it has the EU's not-so-hidden hand behind it.
What about the exploitation of students - making them have an ID card before they get their loan is disgusting!
@Anonymous 1:04pm said...
// Whoever annotated the document is clearly paranoid. Their interpretation of a lot of the points is peculiar. They don't live in the real world. //
As opposed to Gordon, and his bunch of whacko sleazeballs, none of whom have held down a proper job in their lives (bar that Alan Johnson, who was a postie. Should have kept his day job though). Anon, it is government paranoia that is behind the ID card project. Nowt else, you sill boy/girl. Anyone how trusts this govt will get all they deserve and more.
so, the new labour war and occupation party wants to introduce internment on the british mainland to allow time for further investigation after terrorist atrocities have happened. yet they refuse to allow terrorists telephone conversations to be recorded during the planning stage.
but they do allow local councils to tap the phone conversations of fly-tippers.
are these new labour cunts trying to encourage terrorist acts to happen? I think they are because every attack makes it easier for them to force their authoritarian measures such as ID cards through parliament.
in my view new labour are facilitating terrorist actions for their own political gain.
similar tactics were deployed by the british government during the ira terrorist campaign.
Governments are so useless at managing large-scale projects and one might have thought that the current incumbents would have twigged this by now.
Oh no. Not a chance. Leaving aside issues of civil liberties, this ID card scheme will be crap and it will be inexpensive. It will not work.
What next? The Bottom Inspectors?
Unfortunately, New Labour's brave new world is more Viz than 1984.
Can someone please explain to me how we,the people,can vote out all of these lunatics?there are 60m of us and 300 or so labour mps and a handful of cabinet members....why are they allowed to lie? why are they selling us out behind our backs? if they worked for a company they would have to explain their actions...if they told lies or were caught stealing money they would be SACKED!....why are they unaccountable?
We are supposed to be a DEMOCRACY but are held to ransom by traitors,liars and cheats!
please tell me how we table a motion of no confidence or call an election.........there must be something we can do?
The people foisting this on England are the most despicable, cowardly, treacherous cunts imaginable.
I fucking loathe them and their fucking lying shit, it actively encourages people to take up arms against them those fucking stalinist bastards.
Come the revolution you motherfuckers.
It is utterly extraordinary that not one of these Government jackasses has noticed at all, not until now, that universal compulsion "cannot be delivered quickly .. and would pose serious political, enforcement and resource challenges."
You can say that again, Government jackass. What policy will be proposed to overcome the "enforcement challenges" - carpeting the entire green belt with new prisons to hold the refuseniks? Yes I know, prison isn't mentioned per se - but what will you do when millions refuse to co-operate and then to pay the fines?
I have lived in three countries where ID cards are compulsory. Most people in those countries accept them quite happily and find them useful for many purposes.
I would have no objection to them in the UK.
Oh, I do just lurve, yes truly lurve our wonderful, wonderful government.
This ID card nonsense was just starting to worry me. It'd really FU my lifestyle. Now they're gonna be upsetting so many folks with it and so many are gonna be screwing the system slipping thru the cracks is gonna be a doddle. Actually easier than before. ID cards? I want one . I want lots of them. One for every day of the weeek. Thankyou Jaqui Five Bellies. Thankyou Gordon Snotgobbler. You're making me sooo sooo happy.
On an associated subject:
Popped over to France as a walk on on the ferry last week. Before you get thru Passport Control your luggage & metal objects go through X-ray & you go through the metal detector. There were 4 of us on that trip which meant that security & passport outnumbered us 5-4. I must remember to bring the car next time & keep the Uzi in the boot under the dog blanket.
"Tell the Captain I'm hijacking this ship. Take me to Libya"
"I'm sorry sir, but we've only got enough fuel to get to Dieppe."
So the general mood might be portrayed as
"You can fuck off with your fucking ID cards, you fucking fucks"
- yes?
If so, I'm with that.
Fuck 'em, they can't grab all of us.
They seem to forget that a lot of us have been preparing for this battle a lot longer than this shower of incompetent wankers have been preparing it.
Annonymong 8.23:
I suggest you fuck off back to your ID card paradise you twat.
I read the document via the link.It is in that infantile pseudo language favoured by our rulers.They are going to get us through our children.No ID card no further education."Join the serfs son or sign here". Then inform on your parents and a nice fat EU job waits for you.There is no sign that they understand what the meaning of "freedom or freeman" is.They will grant us a spurious liberty which is not the same thing at all.And if you need this explaining then you are one of them.May they rot in hell.
bristol dirt bag 5:16 PM
"Shagging the missus tonight...ID card."
Hell.
(Although, to be fair, I already have to get out the credit card)
We had ID cards in this country for 13 years in the middle of the 20th century - during the war and for SEVEN YEARS AFTER the end of the war.
Over 100 countries have compulsory ID cards and many others have voluntary ones.
they execute thousands of people in china and chop them up to sell their organs........so should we do that?
if its ok for them then SURELY it must be ok for us then?
Where is Clarence Willcock when we need him?
The man who told the Police to fuck off in 1950 when asked to produce his ID card...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3129302.stm
Anon at 11:05 and 11:12
but you know it's the type of ID cards and what they'll be used for that is what makes them so objectionable.
Cunts.
or is that stupid cunts looking forward to their zyklon B showers.
ID cards are an EU diktat which our spineless and useless government will slavishly follow.
They also fit perfectly with Nu Labour (Old Socialist) total state control philosophy.
Sadly, we can kick the present localgovernment out but the cards will be back as the EU never gives up because of something as trivial as democratic accountability or the views of the people - witness the constitution.
Get rid of Nu Labour and get out of the EUssr as well.
@Anonymous 11:05pm said...
// We had ID cards in this country for 13 years in the middle of the 20th century - during the war and for SEVEN YEARS AFTER the end of the war
//
You haven't been concentrating have you? There are ID cards, and there are ID cards. I suggest you read the document Guido links to, and think again.
Did you know, if you move and forget to notify the authorities, you will be fined £1000? Did you know, you will have to go for a compulsory interrogation (their words) by a govt lackey, to get your ID card?
Wake up, ostrich
@Dunfearin:
Thank fuck us jocks won't have them - well not while the SNP are in power...
Well you'll have to go for independence, then. The IPS is working with reserved matters, as far as possible, e.g. immigration - and prerogative where it can, e.g passports. The previous Scottish Executive was so keen on the database state that it announced a Scottish "entitlement card" to hoover up the transformational government functions it was being denied by the Parliament's opposition to the UK NIS - only a couple of weeks after the motion repudiating Westminster's ID card for devolved services. The estimable Mr Salmond has yet to scrap the Entitlement Card, even though it collects data like anything and that data can be sucked by statutory instrument into the Whitehall scheme.
Death to parliament and the EU. We need revolution.
I saw a lot of ID cards yesterday. At the Holocaust exhibition at the IWM.
"Over 100 countries have compulsory ID cards and many others have voluntary ones."
And hardly any of them have a massive database linked to sites all over the country, with electronic terminals used to monitor every time you access a government controlled service and eventually every time you have to identify yourself at all.
Put this together with the proliferation of CCTV cameras and you have a scheme of surveillance unrivalled in any country of the world including China, North Korea and Burma.
Yes, they have ID cards in Germany. But it is illegal in the German constitution for the German government to hold information on the people in a database. In the UK they plan to have all the information they can get on us. Every piece of information they already have on us is already being linked between separate UK databases for criminal records, health records, welfare, tax before the ID cards are even introduced.
Your papers please has a nice ring to it for our EU masters.
Wait till the European wide police force (Europol) is in action and the 'request' can be delivered by a chap in a spiffy uniform with peaked cap and shiny boots.
As with all EU legislation (remember we were once in the common market not the EU) ID cards are the thin end of a very fucking nasty wedge.
The entitlement card is for the elderly and disabled. It does not need a fingerprint nor does it store the 50 items of info on an RFID scannable chip.
My mum and dad have one.
What is your point, caller?
dunfearin,
Biometrics are almost irrelevant as the document suggests. Data sharing isa total red herring. Neither would the IPS store "50 items of info on an RFID scannable chip". They'd have 50 categories (extendable) of information steadily accruing on a central database. The card's just for you to carry your number around with you.
On the entitlement card: Read the terms and conditions.
http://www.jwelford.demon.co.uk/snec/report.pdf
http://wikileaks.org/ has more info on the story.
@Anon 11:25am
There already IS a "Europol"
http://www.eurogendfor.org/
And - it has military status. I.E. Could be used to put us down when we take to the streets to evict ZaNu Labour PF.
dunfesterin, not East Germany 1985 more like East Germany 1965.
And to all those who have whined about other countries which already have ID cards - THIS IS ENGLAND YOU STUPID SLEEPWALKING MORONS and we have enjoyed special freedoms for centuries since Magna Carta before this fucking bunch of Nazi wannabes got into power. WAKE UP!
If this happens it's civil war and I'm for the barricades. Who is with me?
from wikipedia:
Under the NIR UK Residents will be required to:
* Attend in person to be photographed, have their fingerprints taken and iris scanned.
* Promptly inform the police or Home Office if a card is lost or damaged.
* Promptly inform the National Identity Register of any change of address.
* Promptly inform the National Identity Register of significant changes to their personal life.
It's not about ID Cards.
It's all about the database, and enabling the banks to call in the debts when the house of cards collapses.
That's why you have to tell them where you live, and immediately inform them when you move, under threat of jail sentence if you don't.
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