Who Is the Real Inner Tosser?
The Tories have come up with a new social-action campaign about debt. It has all the hallmarks of being the product of a coke-crazed ad exec's inspired idea thought up after lunch in Soho. Guido is at a loss as to understand the thinking behind it. Are the Tories becoming a sort of posh version of the Salvation Army? The Tories de-regulated the credit market under Thatcher, now they are warning the poor about the perils of high interest rates?
The campaign website focuses on the "inner tosser" in us that gets us to whip out our credit cards in orgiastic consumerism. Guido is a fan of capitalism, the Tories used to be as well, credit is crucial to the productive allocation of capital and the creation of wealth. Nevertheless, "avoid getting into debt" is the stern Conservative party's message. That is the same Conservative Party which is incidentally £27 million pounds in debt.
Is it just Guido or does the demonic personification of the inner tosser from the video bear a resemblance to Nigel Morris (pictured in the middle), the mega-rich co-founder of Capital One Financial Corporation, the firm which plagues our letterboxes with credit card offers targeting potential customers with "impaired debt histories". The same tosser who "lent" Labour £1m?
65 comments:
Let's get this straight: the Tories have NOT come up with a new social-action campaign about debt. They are most certainly NOT becoming 'a sort of posh version of the Salvation Army'.
Stop playing into the Labour "so-called" government's hands by peddling this claptrap. Or do you not want a Tory government?
Generally, its the banks that will get their fingers burnt and the those in debt will move on with an impaired credit record...so!
Don't know what all the fuss is about, its the poor people who use loan sharks that need protecting, meanwhile, let the 'market' find its own level, nothting that the Government does makes it any better.
ps, where did that guy get his shoes...just wanted to know so I can avoid the shop!
George Osbourne's credibility has just fallen through the floor.
John Bull, time to up your mogadon dosage old chap.
Anon 1:19 What credibility?
@ John Bull
Aren't you getting a bit concerned that your "so-called" so-called catchphrase isn't really catching on? Are you a little bit confused why not?
I think the answer may be here:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/vote_2005/default.stm
This is Cameron's problem all over. He knows what he believes doesn't work so he's casting around, without a compass, for something else. Sometimes it works, sometimes it is a horrible embarassment.
And everyone knows that New Labour's social democracy is the big capitalists' best option right now.
Anonymous, for it is you...Osbourne has been getting some very good press recently...don't say you are jealous?
I agree with Hedgy. The/Any government needs to stop interfering with market dynamics. If people are too dumb to manage their own affairs let them loose their houses and go bankrupt, and if the market players are too dumb to lend sensibly let them take their losses as the proles go bankrupt. It a market place, it'll find it's own balance so long as knobwit politicians stop interfering.
Insolvencies are at their highest ever level.
Financial literacy is shcokingly low.
Credit card companies consistently provide unclear information to consumers.
Of course something needs to be done. Only an eejit would think otherwise.
Good on the Tories for rolling up their sleeves and trying to do something about it.
Aaah Nigel Morris. Now I know who is responsible for the flood of unwanted crap coming through my letterbox, and those stupid arsewipes trying to mug you in motorway service stations when all you really want to do is get to the bogs for a slash.
A message for you Nige darling, If I ever meet you I shall personally return all the crap you've ever sent me.
Without lube
"Any government needs to stop interfering with market dynamics"
Indeed. But that implies a free market in money. A government's right to dictate what is acceptable as money is after all their greatest source of power.
Mark h - One problem is that when the proles go bankrupt, those of us with positive bank accounts lose out.
The result can only be lower interest rates (relative to base rate) for those in credit, or higher mortgage rates. Or lower bank profits (yeah, right) and lower share prices.
I suppose we could invest in putting on a few raves instead...
The other problem is that the govenment ends up bailing half of them out, again at the expense of those who haven't been so reckless.
I'm no expert - but isn't the Sunday Times David Cracknell the perfect example of an inner tosser?
"One problem is that when the proles go bankrupt, those of us with positive bank accounts lose out."
Thanks for the comment. On the contrary I disagree. Where I choose to deposit my cash is my market choice. If banks in this country reduce rates of return I can choose - provided there is no state interference - to deposit it in another country. I can choose to deposit it in another currency, I can choose to convert it to another asset type, and of course I will make that decision with the juristiction in questions tax competitiveness taken into consideration too.
As for the insistence of another commentator on this board that action needs to be taken, this view can only hold water if you are of a statist persuasion and believe that the state knows better than the proletariat what is best for the proletariat. It is quite evident from my observations that the state rarely know better than the proles, and that the state forget their place in society to serve the proles and not the other way around. I guess if your living is earned stealing from the proles though you're never going to agree with me, but that's a conversation for another day
"If banks in this country reduce rates of return I can choose - provided there is no state interference - to deposit it in another country"
True - but bank rates normally adjust with the BoE interest rate. Any adjustment in the latter usually affects forex rates, potentially negating any benefit gained from moving your cash offshore.
Is the Tories 'inner tosser' different in any way to the Labour Party's 'outer tosser' members, such as a certain former North London member with chronic masturbatory problems whose surnames sounds rather tree-like?
Exactly. Thats what a market is. Incidentally, I can take advantage of that by holding positions in futures contracts, commodities, or non government issued stores of wealth.
"non government issued stores of wealth"
Hehe - that'll be G-O-L-D then. Quite right too.
'inner tosser'? I want to know what to do with our 'elected tossers'!
Didn't Cameron recently sat he agrees with student tuition fees (hence student debt).
Is he saying that everybody who chooses to go to university now pandering to their 'inner tosser'.
Or is this just a campaign dreamed up by Etonion toffs who could run to mummy to pay off their lavish coke habits?
Talk about own goal.
In the 80s it was Toryboy 'loads a money' in the 21st its Tory tossers all over again - although this cutesy attempt to reverse that image is just more spin
@expriest
There is a difference between going into debt to purchase the latest 42" jisma entertainment experience and borrowing to get a degree.
With a degree you should (unless you're dumb enough to do a poxy media studies course) end up in a position to pay back your debt and more.
He looks to me like David Sullivan, the well-known football club boss and porn baron. In other words, a man whose entrepreneurial traits we should all be proud of.
Mind you, his faux mansion in Essex is a carbuncle on the face of an old friend
With the present government passing more and more laws to bail out people who simply can't wait until next month for those new shoes why would anyone bother taking this advert seriously?
Markets are only efficient if there are risks as well as rewards.
Think I'll go and buy myself that new Maserati on tick.
I am a free market fundamentalist, however I also see that some people do not understand debt.
Some people actually buy a car via remortaging, by the time the loan is repaid the car will be rust.
The only rational reason to borrow money is if you can earn more than the interest because you borrowed. I'm not in favour of banning irationality if that was possible.
Money is time. Debt is simply selling your future time.
For the above reasons I would actually (and against my normal principles) bring in Debt licensing. A simple test to show you can work out interest rates, and the final cost of a few items and discount their final value (the real cost).
If a business lends to someone without a license they only need to pay back the loaned amount, not the interest. If you claim you have a license when you don't you are jailed for fraud. If you borrow and have a license then on your head be it.
Why should 'The State' (it's not the state, actually, in this case) not warn people of potential harm that could occur to them?
None of you Free Market lovers seem to mind when the NHS issues anti-AIDS warnings, or enforces warnings on cigarette packets.
"If people are too dumb to manage their own affairs let them loose their houses and go bankrupt" - nice. I guess you were thinking what they were thinking...
Sanctimonious cunts.
All this nannying and we'll end up as a communist republic with our dear leaders granting us pocket money to buy broken biscuits and tokens to go to the soup kitchen.
A pox on the scum.
Sanctimonious cunts.
All this nannying and we'll end up as a communist republic with our dear leaders granting us pocket money to buy broken biscuits and tokens to go to the soup kitchen.
A pox on the scum.
A government's right to dictate what is acceptable as money is after all their greatest source of power.
It would be if they could have it, but they can't. All they can do is delay the inevitability of the market doing what it will do, and in the process of delay make things worse. In the words of Maggie, you can't buck the market.
That's why the whole pound/euro thing was such a disaster and why with politicians no longer trying to "dictate what is acceptable as money" as they used to, exchange rates & inflation are no longer daily disasters.
My sister is loosely involved in this campaign as founder of one of the charities that's been advising the Tories (among others - we're apolitical but the Tories are the only party that's listening at the moment thanks to IDS and his stellar work at the Centre for Social Justice) on their policies on debt. I have to say I cringed when I saw the frankly bloody awful campaign the ad agency have made of it.
The issue is a serious one though. I'm all for the free market, but the free availability of credit is like making unlimited crack available to druggies - it's bound to end in tears. Couple that with the sheer bloody inefficiency of banks and other financial institutions and it's easy to see how a debt of a few hundred pounds can quickly spiral to thousands.
What I would hope a future Conservative government would do is have a long hard look at encouraging personal responsibilities from a young age so the young Waynes and Sharons of this world know from the beginning that it's a bad idea to spend money that you don't have. Either that or a radical programme of castration on the council estates :-)
@charlieboy
Actually I'd rather 'The State' did the job of educating on financial matters at school.
However it is not in the state's interest for everyone to discover just how much of their wealth is taxed through inflation.
I hope loan shark (alleged) Morris squeezes the Lab twits dry... a great way for Nu Labour to bond with their former electoral base.
We are in two asset bubbles at the moment - houses and credit growth. They are obviously intertwined - re-mortgaging, or unsecured debt granted to those who are deemed to be Homeowners.
The great thing about these two bubbles is that they get to burst simultaneously.
It's going to be ugly, I'm afraid. I reckon Dave and Gideon have worked out that it might just happen on their watch.....
Now if you'll excuse me, I need to transfer debt from one card to another that has just offered me 3% for twelve months.....
Guido - I am confused ? I thought the Tory party venerated Margaret Thatcher who thought it very important to live within one's means ? Surely this ad is very much in touch with that, and not falling prey to adman connery.
The borrower is servant to the lender, or perhaps you would like to see the poor kept barefoot, pregnant and up to their necks in debt and guaranteed slavery ?
"The great thing about these two bubbles is that they get to burst simultaneously."
The housing bull market is already unusually long in the tooth, thanks to the disinflationary effects of globalisation holding interest rates down.
This situation could go on a lot longer than people expect but those Chinese workers won't be on a dollar-a-day for ever ...
Osborne denigrators note correct spelling. Osborne's credibility is a fucking darnside better than Gordon Moron. GO is AAA to GB's Junk.
Brown is desperate to put distance between himself and #11 before the shit hits the fan. UK are tops : cocaine, personal debt, alcohol consumption. Isn't life grand.
"Inner Tosser"?
So this is something to do with nunky Dunky's private member's motion draw?
Or is it something which England desperately need in Brisbane?
Guido, I think what you are missing out on is the films are actually very amusing and feature some rather loverly TVRs. Made in Britain too. Not that we would want to encourage British manufacturing to get people to fund their purchases with loans - oh no siree...
But it was rather kind of you to play the part of the 'inner tosser' and put your thespian skills to good use.
In a rather half arsed and dimwitted way methinks whoever did draw up the idea for this campaign might have actually stumbled on the real solution to the debt problem.
The issue isn't really the lending institutions; they are simply doing what they are in business to do.
The big issue is that the vast majority of the British public have not the slightest clue how interest actually works. Not because they are thick (though some undoubtedly are) but because no one has ever seen fit to teach them. And it's not a particularly hard lesson.
I'm an engineer; I "do" maths - it took me about an hour to understand. A former Ms Remittance who while admirable in many ways had the mathematical ability of a spastic chicken took a day.
That's right, even a dimwitted bimbo can learn all about the effect of compound interest in eight hours. What's more, she had me as her teacher and I admit I have the patience and teaching ability of that same handicapped chook.
To quote some grinning eejit I saw on the telly once: "The answer is education. Education. Education".
Anon 1.25 "And everyone knows that New Labour's social democracy is the big capitalists' best option right now" I think you mean corporatist rather than capitalist - maybe I'm splitting hair's
Anon 3.41 "adman connery" - surely he's an actor??
Guido, I am surprised to see all the comments along the lines of 'Tories used to believe in capitalism...' or 'Tories used to hate Polly Toynbee...' etc.
The key word is 'used'. Parties have to change and adapt to grow and prosper.
Just think, Man Utd wouldn't be the great team they if they still picked Bryan Robson and Eric Cantona. They bring in new blood, new ideas & fresh thinking.
That's why they can continue to be the Man Utd of British politics, and not be taken over by a foreigner like West Ham just have.
So people should support the Conservatives in a partisan fashion, even as they spout anti-capitalist rhetoric and insult virtually the entire electorate? Right...
I make a handsome living finding these "tossers" and helping them to sort themselves out (for a fee natch) long may they continue you pis smoney up the wall.
No need for an advertising campaign - all is revealed below:
Find the Total (T) if you begin with Principal (P) accruing at annual interest rate (r) over (y) years.
0: T(0) = P
1: T(1) = P*(1 + r/100)
2: T(2) = T(1)*(1 + r/100) = P*(1 + r/100)*(1 + r/100) = P*(1 + r/100)^2
3: T(3) = T(2)*(1 + r/100) = P*(1 + r/100)*(1 + r/100)*(1 + r/100) = P*(1 + r/100)^3
=) T(y) = P*(1 + r/100)^y
Lesson over.
guido faux
What about discounting that for inflation? Or the likelihood of your death? Or the likelihood that Gordon will steal it before you get to spend it?
When it comes to profligate spending the biggest tosser of the lot is Gordon Brown but THIS will finish him off once and for all:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=418002&in_page_id=1770
The housing bubble is about to burst taking with it the rampant spending frenzy that has kept Brown's so-called "miracle economy" afloat....
quote:"Housing market at risk of bursting
by BECKY BARROW
Daily Mail
22nd November 2006
Britain's booming housing market is on the brink of a major collapse, a former Government adviser has said.
In a dire warning to the country's 18 million home-owners, David Miles said 'a significant fall' could be just months away..."
Professor Miles is chief economist at Morgan Stanley and one of the foremost financial experts in Europe so he probably knows what he's talking about unlike those hair-gelled, smarmy estate agents who the media love to describe as property experts.
Will the Tories have to pick up the pieces again?
'Will the Tories have to pick up the pieces again?'
not being rude anonymong but old Nigel had more than a bit to do with the last housing led recession.
Mrs Mortice,dear thing,is a great fan of buy to let at the minute--for me that's the strongest sell sign there is.
Rigger Mortice said...
Mrs Mortice,dear thing,is a great fan of buy to let at the minute--for me that's the strongest sell sign there is.
Oh dear! Your missus isn't Rosie Millard is she?
Get her to have a look over here:
http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?act=SF&s=&f=22
I really hope TB mentions Cameron's inner tosser at next weeks PMQs....
I also found it ironic that those in debt were encouraged to seek help from their Students' Union; they very same Unions the Tories tried to close down for being radical loony left annoyances to them about 15 years ago.
Debt is the new religion. It is the way to control the ignorant masses - grab them by the financial testicles and their slavish obedience will follow. Gordon Brown knows this, why can't DC and his loony chums show a similar level of Machievellian cunning?
Tories always deregulate credit when they are in office............there is always a property boom and bust - now Brown has copied them and stayed in power for 3 terms.
Look at interest rate charts and how they exploded after Competition & Credit Control in 1971 and Heath letting the money supply rip.
The same under Thatcher and Lawson - easy credit until it peaked in 1988 with double-mortgage relief for the unmarried boosting housing over the edge.
Tories create property booms - Labour creates trade deficits - now Brown does both and keeps the Tories in Opposition
voyager said...
Tories create property booms - Labour creates trade deficits - now Brown does both and keeps the Tories in Opposition
Not for much longer. It looks like the shit is going to hit the economic fan next year leaving Brown's fading reputation in tatters.
Come on Osborne lad, let's see you putting the boot into this charlatan a bit more often. When you take him on you make a monkey out of him.
Hedgy said:
Osbourne has been getting some very good press recently...don't say you are jealous?
I gave him some the good press, I retract every word. The bloody fools.
Put a peg on your nose and vote Cameron?
Aviod getting into debt? Codswallop.
Avoid getting into debt if you have any assets is more like it, bankruptcy is a piece of cake.
Lloyds TSB are never getting their £14k back, I still have a bank account and I can even use their cashpoint.
Thanks Lloyds TSB, it was fun whilst it lasted
Presumably Mr Cameron and co want to attract these reformed Tossers to. . .er the Toss-pots.
I'd say it looks more like uber-capitalist Guido Fawkes rather than Nigel Morris...
Trying to pass the buck Guido?
@Voyager
1971 - also happens to be the year the world went off the gold standard, destabilizing interest rates.
It looks more like Iain Dale...
We should just ban people earning less than 15k from borrowing money. Problem solved.
Has anyone told them what "tosser" means? You can't actually use that word in polite society, even now.
The problem is "education, education, education" and the total lack of it despite being the first three New Labour policies since 1997.
I cant quite work out what in this country is worth spending ones money on. If I want to spend I do it in another country where and when I feel free and am getting proper value for my hard earned cash.
I have 4 credit cards. Why? I have no idear as I hardly ever use them.
However there is no point being the richest man in the graveyard or leaving it all to the kidds.
So good on you spendaholics without you irresponsible no hopers my companys would not make any profit.
Work till you drop if you wish, I will be retireing well before I am fifty and will be having a long very lazy laugh while you are still paying your credit cards and morgages off.
Is it getting near time for the men in suit's to have a gentle word in young Dave's shell like?
"Work till you drop if you wish, I will be retireing well before I am fifty and will be having a long very lazy laugh while you are still paying your credit cards and morgages off."
Why is this page full of the above sort of petty, vicious taunting from pampered, rich fuckwits who are deluded enough to believe that their wealth has anything to do with their relative intelligence?
I'm close to defining Conservatives as 'people who think all their good fortune is the result of their own superhuman abilities, and all their bad fortune is the result of other people's animalistic stupidity.'
Or maybe just 'arrogant, deranged lunatics'. While you're investing your hard-hoarded cash in another country, why don't you move there too?
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